LadyTinuviel
Hobbit
.::May it be, an evening star, shines down upon you::.
Posts: 25
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Post by LadyTinuviel on Jul 15, 2004 12:53:35 GMT -5
Just wanted to post my thought that The Silmarillion; the Creation of Middle Earth is a little bit like the Christian story of Creation. Illuvatar to me, seems like God. Then the three Elf races, the vanyar, noldor, and the teleri are kind of like the different religions of the world; different lifestyles even. I wanted to know what other people think on the subject. ;DTEXT
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Post by RavenLady on Jul 17, 2004 16:42:50 GMT -5
With the minor exception of the Avari, and the Noldor who left Valinor, Elves seem to believe pretty much the same things, even though the cultures are different. But I've noticed some Christian influence too, for instance, the Valar seem a bit like angels.
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Post by TariAmandil on Jul 20, 2004 12:02:11 GMT -5
I think that for Tolkien the elves represented his more aesthetic beliefs. (and I probably spelled aesthetic wrong!! lol)
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Post by Frodo Baggins on Jul 21, 2004 11:10:49 GMT -5
Tolkien was a very religious catholic, so it might be there he got it from...
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Post by LadyofIthilien on Jul 22, 2004 22:05:41 GMT -5
I also think that Ilúvatar is representing God. The vision that Ilúvatar presents to the Ainur of the new world is like God presenting his plan of salvation in the premortal life to us. The holy ones that had fallen into darkness with Melkor are like the third of the host of heaven that were cast out with melkor(ahem satan). And he created the children of Ilúvatar (Elves and Men). Well as you know God created us. So we're like the Elves and Men. The Children of God. Little is known of the ultimate future of the Ainur (I take the Ainur to represent Jesus Christ. He doesn't even know the ultimate future) , even by themselves, but it is said that, after the great battle at the end of the World (ahem this should be sounding familiar), they will make a Second, even greater, Music with the Children of Ilúvatar (ring a bell anyone?? the second coming maybe??). This is just how I see it. I don't know about anyone else and I'm not looking to get into an argument because we interpret things differently...
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LadyTinuviel
Hobbit
.::May it be, an evening star, shines down upon you::.
Posts: 25
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Post by LadyTinuviel on Jul 23, 2004 8:29:24 GMT -5
I think I spelled similarities wrong heheh ;D
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Post by Frodo Baggins on Jul 23, 2004 10:31:35 GMT -5
We understood what you ment, Tinuviel.
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Post by ~Èlven Ðreamer Child~ on Jul 23, 2004 14:24:37 GMT -5
I know there are similarities. Even Tolkien admitted that there were. He was so a part of his religion that it naturally became a part of his writing. If you truly believe in something it should become a part of everything you do. Even if unconsciously.
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Post by Frodo Baggins on Aug 4, 2004 12:16:01 GMT -5
Yeah, I think you are right about that.
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Istari
Hobbit
What?! How dare you say white makes me look like a panzy! DIE!!!
Posts: 48
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Post by Istari on Aug 5, 2004 20:16:19 GMT -5
ya kno, i haven't read all of the silmarillion, only some, but out of what i've read, now that i think about it, it really seems similar...o! there are also some religious similarities in starwars
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Istari
Hobbit
What?! How dare you say white makes me look like a panzy! DIE!!!
Posts: 48
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Post by Istari on Aug 5, 2004 20:16:41 GMT -5
ya kno, i haven't read all of the silmarillion, only some, but out of what i've read, now that i think about it, it really seems similar...o! there are also some religious similarities in starwars, but i don't think this is the forum for that...whoops, sry, didn't mean to double post..stupid computer...
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Post by Sarawen on Aug 6, 2004 23:36:15 GMT -5
I also think that Ilúvatar is representing God. The vision that Ilúvatar presents to the Ainur of the new world is like God presenting his plan of salvation in the premortal life to us. The holy ones that had fallen into darkness with Melkor are like the third of the host of heaven that were cast out with melkor(ahem satan). And he created the children of Ilúvatar (Elves and Men). Well as you know God created us. So we're like the Elves and Men. The Children of God. Little is known of the ultimate future of the Ainur (I take the Ainur to represent Jesus Christ. He doesn't even know the ultimate future) , even by themselves, but it is said that, after the great battle at the end of the World (ahem this should be sounding familiar), they will make a Second, even greater, Music with the Children of Ilúvatar (ring a bell anyone?? the second coming maybe??). This is just how I see it. I don't know about anyone else and I'm not looking to get into an argument because we interpret things differently... I agree. I haven't made it all th way through the Sil yet but I'm working on it. It's complicated and I like that. I agree that Iluvatar is like God and that the Ainur are like Angels. I think Morgoth is like Satan. I like when the Ainur are watching the vision of Ea. They see strife and Morgoth causing havic but then it says the Morgoth doesn't even realize that what he does to mess up Ea will eventually work for the good of its creation. I wonder what Tolkien thought of as the ending for all of it. I mean, it sounds like Iluvatar had a purpose for them all to return to "heaven." Does anyone know if Tolkien wrote about the ending at all? I'd be neat to see what he thought. Or maybe he didn't write about it because in his Christian faith, the Bible doesn't give a clear picture as to what life will like after this world is over. ....I wonder.
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Post by LadyofIthilien on Aug 7, 2004 8:35:09 GMT -5
Yeah...Sad to say but I haven't made my way through the Simarillion yet either. I'm about halfway done. I haven't read all the books either...I'm trying to though. I've read the Hobbit. And I've attempted FotR like 4 times. Ok this is motivating once I've seen what a slacker I am. I'm going to start reading today and see how far I get. *runs off to the special bookshelf where all of her unread editions of LotR are*
Hey! This is my eleventy-first post!!! GO ME
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Post by Sarawen on Aug 8, 2004 14:45:56 GMT -5
you're trying to read the Sil? I am also, we should talk about it along the way perhaps. That would be fun. Where are you? I'm more towards the beginning but I'll get there.
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Post by LadyofIthilien on Aug 8, 2004 15:27:27 GMT -5
I'm on chapter 14. I got stuck there cause uh..well...just look at the title. Of Beleriand And It's Realms. It just tells about who owned what land and their people and yada yada yada. All I really need is a map (like the one that is in that chapter already) to tell me about that. It's kinda slow reading...you have to have alot of time on your hands without any interuptions. I call it the LotR bible. ;D
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